Author: Nameless Heathen

  • An experiment. Humor. Or talk to the Nameless Heathen

    I see from web logs that people are visiting, that some are staying and I’d like to hear from the people that are visiting, and know what interests you.

    I’ve created a del.icio.us id, namelessheathen

    I’ll add topical links there. Email me (namelessheathen at gmail dot com) if you think I should write on something there. If you use del.icio.us add me to your network and submit links to articles you’d like me to read and comment on.

    For a starter I think the first three links below are hilarious, and should I ever become the “named heathen” I’d plaster my car with stuff from the last one (with whom I have no affiliation, by the way)

    Evolution: A journal of nature (magazine: 1927-1938) comics

    Over Three Hundred Proofs of God’s Existence

    Door To Door Atheists Bother Mormons – BREAK.com

    Darwin Fish and Evolve FISH sales and more

  • Brief thoughts on “A Brief History of Disbelief”, History and Government.

    A while back I caught one episode of “A Brief History of Disbelief” (it’s a BBC Production) and I was completely overwhelmed. It’s wonderful. You have to see it. Google video has it online. I wanted to be able to look at it off line, so after an excruciatingly long download, I was able to get it via bittorrent for safekeeping.

    Jonathan Miller narrates this production, and he was wonderfully erudite and thoughtful, opening with his disdain for describing himself as an atheist. Not because he’s embarrassed or ashamed, but because it seems a trivial aspect of himself, one not worth the bother. I’d never heard of Dr. Miller before, but now I can’t imagine a more perfect person to present this. ( I’d like to know more about him. I’ll start with this book of his photos).

    I noticed that during the beginning of the show I became a little jealous of the British. I’m convinced that it’s easier to be an atheist there than here in the US of A. Despite Ireland. (Heard the joke about the Irish pondering an atheist? … “Yes, Yes I know he’s an atheist, but is he an Catholic atheist or a Protestant atheist?”) I believe that the Church of England as an official state religion has reduced religiosity to appropriate levels in daily life. (There seems to be a series of “winning really means losing” episodes in Christian history. I should write about that sometime.)

    The show discusses early Greek and Roman thoughts on God(s), including this very modern sounding series of questions by Lucretius,

    “Is God willing to prevent evil but not able?

    Then He is not omnipotent.

    Is He able but not willing?

    Then he is malevolent. ”

    The show made an observation I found interesting. Monotheism made it harder for societies to tolerate atheists. When there are many gods to choose from, those who believe in no gods are less obviously different than when all are expected to have common religion.

    Another couple interesting observations were:

    1) That early on it was the job of the Church to punish nonbelievers, and the state only later took up the job. In the early 1600’s England’s Parliament passed a law condemning atheists to death. My guess is that the state taking that responsibility was an outgrowth of the struggle between church and state for power started with Henry the II’s struggle with Thomas Beckett, and carrying through to Henry the VIII’s assumption of church leadership. I guess somebody had to punish non-believer’s and since Parliament was fighting with James the 1st for power, they thought they should take that on. Look here for a good summary of the struggles of Englands’ government. I’m grateful that the church (and James I) lost this struggle, given how the state has evolved (both in the US and the UK).

    2) That it was the wealthy who (carefully) dabbled with disbelief toward the end of the 1600’s. The British deist‘s began the discussion, and it arguably lead to the care with which the US founding father’s treated religion.

    I’m also grateful for that care. I’m not convinced one way or the other about the religion of the majority founding fathers. My assumption is that then (and now) a significant number of politicians were closet atheists despite what Church they attended, and my imagining is that the hidden atheists were persuasive enough with the rest of the founding fathers to make my government tolerable for me despite the predilections of my fellow citizens. Maybe they hoped for a better day.

    There was great deal of discussion about deists and the founding of the US in the series. Some wonderful quotes (I’ve copied these and the Lucretius one from here, where Sue Lord has laboriously transcribed them from “A Brief History” … Thank you Sue).

    John Adams

    “God is an essence we know nothing of. Until this awful blasphemy is got rid of there will never be any liberal science in the world”

     

    George Washington

    “Let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion. Reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle”

     

    “The government of the United States is in no sense founded on the
    Christian Religion.”

     

    Thomas Jefferson

    “The clergy believe that any power confided in me will be used in opposition to their schemes. And they believe rightly”

     

    President Thomas Jefferson –”I do not find in Christianity one redeeming feature.”

     

    James Buchanan

    “I have seldom met an intelligent person whose views were not narrowed and distorted by religion”

    William Henry Harrison

    “We admit of no government by divine right….The only legitimate

    right to govern is an express grant of power from the governed”

    President Abraham Lincoln -“The Bible is not my book, nor Christianity my religion.”

    President James Madison – “A just government has no need for the clergy or the church.”


    President John F. Kennedy
    “I believe in an America where religious intolerance will someday end… where every man has the same right to attend or not attend the church of his choice.”

    And of course the opposing view, one with which I’m all too familiar.

    George Bush Snr

    “I don’t know that atheists should be considered patriots, nor should they be considered citizens”

    President George W. Bush “The United States is a Christian nation founded upon Christian principles and beliefs.”